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I believe a freight forwarder is trying to scam me and I’m not sure what to do to protect myself.
I sold a digital camera for about $85 to an address in California. The camera was successfully delivered 3 days ago according to tracking. This morning I get a message from the buyer essentially stating that I did not ship the camera (it’s in fairly broken English, but that seems to be the gist of it). It includes a couple photos showing the cameras box and the accessories only, but no picture of the camera. I know for certain that I did ship the camera.
The address is in the US, but Paypal indicates that the payment came from Korea. I googled the shipping address (and google showed the autosuggestion of “ebay” after the address because it’s a popular search), and low and behold it is a notorious freight forwarding scammer. Looks like they have been scamming sellers on eBay for years, based on the number of forums discussing this company.
Does anyone have any suggestions for I should do next? They haven’t filed a case yet, but I’m sure they will be demanding a full refund and then will file a case with either eBay or Paypal.
This is the first time I feel like someone is actively trying to scam me on eBay, which I guess isn’t bad for 3 years of selling.
Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Need some clarification. Is it the actual shipping company that is filing the claim? or is it the original buyer that is using the shipping company?
I only ask because the only person who can file a claim is the actual account that bought the item. The buyer in Korea has to work it out with this shipping company.
IF it’s the shipping company filing the claim, then we would tell them to mail the item back to us. We would file an insurance claim through USPS or whatever insurance you use. They would receive a full refund.
It would be a weird scam to keep the camera but return all the box and all the accessories (like the charger).
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It sucks this happened, but we’ve sold hundreds of items to freight forwarding companies without any issue.
This could be a scam, but it could also just be a shipping issue. Maybe an employee stole an item.They would not be in business long if they ripped off hundred and hundreds of eBay sellers.
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The item was purchased by an individual (with a REF# after the name), but the address is for the freight forwarding company. So the person who contacted me is the actual “buyer,” although further research indicates he is the CEO of the company that does the freight forwarding.
I’ve had no problem with freight forwarding companies in the past, but my alarm bells started going off when I saw all the online threads describing very similar eBay scam situations. I don’t normally jump to call a company a scammer, but I think it looks likely in this situation. I could post the name of the company so others could research it and/or be aware if they see it on an order, but I wasn’t sure if that was okay on these threads or not.
Anyway, I doubt they want to keep the camera only. It looks like they normally bully sellers with the specter of negative feedback and then get a partial or full refund. I guess I’ll have to wait and see what they demand.
I’ll probably call their bluff and tell them to return the item. It was only in a padded flat rate, so I’d be willing to eat that cost just to see if they will actually return the charger, box, and cords. I have 99% positive feedback, so I suppose I can eat a negative, too, and maybe fight to have it removed.
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Understood. I know you’re being calm about it. But remember that if this company tried to make a business out of scamming sellers, they’d need to do it to hundreds of sellers on a regular basis to make enough money. eBay would catch on.
In this case, let them open an actual return case. Just sending a message doesn’t do anything. Once the return case is open, accept the return. If it is a scammer, they wont want to send back all the other stuff.
Even if it is a scammer, how much room to you want to let him rent in your head?
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Well, as I suspected, the buyer opened a case. He entirely skipped any attempt at resolution with eBay and instead went straight to PayPal. He filed a case of “Item not as described – Missing items.”
We’ve sent some messages back and forth. The guy even had the gall to call me a scammer. Anyway, I’m basing my defense basically on the fact that this was clearly sent to an international freight forwarding company, which I proved with a link to the company’s website showing that is their address. The guy filing the claim also has a different name than the one that I shipped to. I talked to PayPal, and they confirmed the buyer is located in Korea. He is claiming he lives in the US and had the package delivered to his work address.
It’s been about a week and he keeps sending messages via the resolution center in PayPal, but so far he has not escalated the claim. It will close after 20 days automatically if he neither of us escalates it. Maybe he’s just trying to intimidate me into capitulating without a fight. I don’t know. I think I have a good case, but I realize these things are always heavily weighted in favor of the buyer. I sent a final message a few minutes ago, but now I’m going dark and going to see what happens from here.
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How can the person making the claim has a different name from the person who bought the item?
And again, we always force the buyers hand: accept the return and wait till everything is returned before they get the refund. If the buyer if just trying to get something for free, this takes away that incentive.
Paypal and eBay love this because you’re giving the buyer a choice. What they dont love is digging in our heels and denying the claim. Thats when they’ll just give an automatic refund and let the buyer keep the item.
So I’d again just offer the refund on a return and then go silent.
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The name on the shipping address is for the owner of the freight forwarding company and it included a reference number at the end which indicated who the item was being shipped to. The buyer is located in Korea and has a different name.
Normally with eBay, I would agree and just offer a return for a refund, but my understanding of PayPal policies is that they will still require the item to be returned before issuing the refund, even if I lose the case. If they just give a refund without forcing the customer to return the item, then I should be able to call and get refunded myself. From what I have read from others scammed by this company, they will return the item, but damage it.
Anyway, I called a PayPal rep the other day when this case was opened and explained the situation of the freight forwarding, and she advised that I have a good chance to win the case.
I guess this gives me a chance to better learn the PayPal dispute process and its policies in general.
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Update: I won. Well, technically, the buyer cancelled the case.
During its investigation, PayPal requested additional information on the transaction from the buyer, probably to verify his bogus story that he works at the international freight forwarding company where the item was delivered.
Of course, this could just be a temporary victory. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a credit card chargeback in the next few days. Hopefully, I’m more trouble than it’s worth and he will move on to an easier target to scam.
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What a mess. I wouldn’t even know where to start on a case like this. I am really impressed with your wealth of knowledge and your research on this company with other eBayers. I am sure that paid off BIG TIME in getting it resolved in your favor. I hope I never have any complicated issues such as this! If I do, I coming to you to help me!
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